S2Ep16 - The Whole Truth (Sun's second flashback) - 03/22/06

Hello my dear friends,

I took a short vacation and have not had a heck of a lot of time to do my typical "research" on last week's show, "The Whole Truth." So instead, I pasted in more posts than usual, as they do a good job of summarizing the main issues.

Before I get into the specific topics, here's a post that captured the overall feeling on the boards about Sun's second flashback episode (and I apologize because a lot of the posts this time around were profanity-laced, as well as crude in parts because of some of the subject matter (you'll see what I'm talking about soon enough)):

- "Basically, despite not doing that much, this episode was FUN. The writers remembered that. Charlie redeemed himself in my eyes by being such a bastard to AnaL...the whole gun thing was just priceless. I was laughing my -ss off. Henry Gale is one scary motherf-cker, no matter whether or not he is evil. That entire scene at the end was just...the guy's sly, and he's smart. I hope he's an other just because he's gonna kill them all. The best part? Him channelling the audience. Trust. Questions. My annoyance with that is that they are clearly mocking us, but at least it's with a decent, mysterious character."

When I was watching this episode, I said to my friends at the end, "Hmmmm, I enjoyed that, but I don't think I'm going to have a lot to say about in on the blog." But after going through a few boards, there actually was more to discuss than I originally thought. Yay for us...


"HEY! YOU! GET OUTTA MY HATCH!" (SET TO ROLLING STONES)

The posts about the Jack/Locke shower scene (Jack gets out of shower, neglects to cover himself with the towel (dries his hair instead), and Locke is there, shaving) were SO vulgar that I couldn't even bring myself to paste any of them in. Suffice it to say that people are sick of the Jack and Locke competition for Alpha Male status, as called out in the episode by Ana Lucia: "Jack and Locke are a little too busy worrying about Locke and Jack."

Even though you know that I love me some Locke, I really can't stand the constant bickering and one-upping, either, because it's just leading them to do stupid things. The biggest thing that worried me, however, was Locke's ownership-mentality about the Hatch ("... Right now there's a man sitting in a room in my hatch and I want him out.").

Here are a few choice posts on the topic:

- "Locke's "My hatch" is very telling about his thought process. More towards his "chosen" mentality. Very subtle but effective."
- "Hooray for More Assertive Locke's return! He doesn't need to ask Jack if Ana-Lucia should interrogate the prisoner. He doesn't have to ask Jack if he can shave while Jack showers. He doesn't have to ask Jack for permission to look at Jack's penis. And in retaliation, Jack gets assertive, too: he decides he doesn't have to ask permission to take Henry out for a bowl of Dharma-Os (love it!)."
- "This episode hit me early on with something strange: when Locke saw Ana Lucia coming his way, he made a remark to her about "running like the devil is chasing her..." When Desmond and Jack first met on the stadium steps in "Man of Science, Man of Faith," Desmond asked Jack why he was "running like the devil is chasing him". HMMM - has Locke been spending so much time down in the hatch that he's starting to channel Desmond?" (e: That is correct, that is the exact same line Desmond used with Jack in the stadium, I noticed it too)


KATE LOOKED GOOD... SUN LOOKED GOOD...

I just wanted you all to know that I'm not ALWAYS negative about Kate. Although I am a tad worried that her mention of having taken a pregnancy test before somehow means we will have to ensure another Kate Flashback. But in the meantime... her tan and her wind-blown hair looked cute and there were many comments regarding this topic on the boards. However, there were even more comments about Sun's lingerie scene at the beginning...


... BUT THE BOYS LOOKED BETTER.

... But the greatest number of comments were about the Lost Boys. If I were to even start pasting in all of the references to Shirtless Jin, Sawyer and Jack, I would never finish this write-up. I was in disbelief at the attention this topic received. Though I agree that they were all lookin' fine.

Here is an article on DDK's hotness.


DEAR GOD

I think TPTB having Sawyer reading "Are you there God? It's me, Margaret" (of all books) was a blatant shout-out to the board peeps to say: "You guys, CHILL. This is definitely a book that means nothing and gives away NO CLUES about the show!"

But guess what, people still tried to find clues - no lie. I spared you those posts. But in case you don't believe me, here's just one: "I believe in the book Margaret was investigating several different religions - do you think that means anything?"


CHARLIE WILL ALWAYS BE A HOBBIT TO ME

Charlie finally won back some fans this episode with his return to snottiness. I must admit, I laughed out loud at his "fake-out" move when giving the gun back to Ana Lucia - oh... no.... wait... Sayid.

On the Hobbit tip:
- "And did anyone else have a "what about second breakfast?" LOTR moment when Charlie came hopping in with papayas for breakfast?" (e: Uh, OF COURSE I did!)
- "I liked surly Charlie more than I would have expected--and the papaya breakfast was such a hobbit moment."
- "Charlie pulling a "Merry" with an armful of natural food."

Not on the Hobbit tip:
- "Charlie gets major points for his little “Ok, I’ll give you the gun…nope, kidding, I’m giving it to Sayid” maneuver. That was such an “oh SNAP” moment. Hilarious."
- "As for Charlie knowing about Henry and not blabbing it all around, I really think he's turned into Darth Hoodie. I think that Claire's rejection has changed him, and that there will be many more surprising and uncharacteristic behaviors from him. Having a gun and not making a fuss about it (my impression was that it was a secret even from Sayid) is not very pre-Claire-dump Charlie. So, maybe this post-Claire-dump Charlie - the Charlie who is willing to faux-abduct Sun - can keep secrets. Secrets are knowledge, and knowledge is power. And I think right now he has a hunger for power that's even more compelling than his hunger for what Virgin Mary keeps where the sun doesn't shine."


DID SHE OR DIDN'T SHE?

I have to say that I ended the episode leaning toward the "Sun cheated" side... but after reading the boards, I am leaning the other way. I challenge you all to read the posts below and let me know if you think she cheated (or if you never even did)... Definitely leave me comments on this one - I can be swayed either way still. I think. So wishy-washy. One thing was definitely agreed upon by everyone: her English tutor's nickname is "bald dude."

But BEFORE getting into the many posts I pasted in on this topic, I will bring up three major points. The first one I didn't see covered anywhere on the boards, so at some point I will probably have to post about it to get reactions (typically I'm actually just a lurker, believe it or not):

1) Near the end of Season One, there was a scene with Sun, Shannon and Claire, when they were having a conversation about fate. And it was Sun who said, "Do you think we're being punished? For the secrets we kept, the lies we told..." I remember thinking at that point: "Hmmm, I know that Sun was going to leave Jin and had secretly learned English, but it seems like she's alluding to more than that in her own life, because all in all she doesn't seem right now like a bad person." Now when I think about those lines, I wonder if she was alluding to her possible affair.

2) Each season is about 40 or so days on the island (currently they are around day 58 or so)... so if she was to carry a baby full-term... that seems like a risky move on the writers' parts... not so sure the series would still be around. Horrible thought, I know.

3) This is a point mentioned below as well, but the question in my mind right now is WHY would she tell Jin that he is infertile if she hadn't decided to tell him "the whole truth"? What point would that serve? If she was going to lie about the father of the baby, why tell the truth about Jin's infertility? This is one of the things that swayed me to the "she didn't cheat" camp.

With those points in mind, here are additional thoughts from the boards to ponder:

- "So, did Sun cheat on Jin with her just-short-of-gay-friend or not? I think we're supposed to think she did, but I don't think she did. I think it's the island craziness that makes Locke walk that makes Jin's boys swim!"
- "I predict that Sun and Jin will be having a Sun Jr, rather then a Jin Jr.; who else is Aaron going to marry?"
- "Even though Jin is unbelievably studly, I was waiting for one last flashback to Sun and that bald dude post coital. I believe Dharma is responsible for Jin's new super sperm."
- "Jack said... "I'm the last one to give advice about that" to Sun on the baby - there is way more to that statement than that. He played it like a throwaway, but I bet it isn't, not with what we've seen in his back story."
- "I think Sun is lying. But I don't want to believe it."
- "As for the A story (Sun/Jin), it was good, I think, because it was a story about two characters who we have truly seen grow, and it GOOD ways, during this show, and I think that this is just good payoff. It's just nice to see that Jin and Sun are working out, and that DDK and YK are knocking it out of the park each week. And I'm glad they didn't go (apparently) the cheating route."
- "I want to know if Sun was lying. I agree I think we were supposed to think she had the affair, but she probably didn't. She was telling the truth, that was the point of this episode."
- "It was nice to see Jin still has some anger issues. Scary, but good continuity."
- "--So, I wonder if Sun is telling the truth? What I love about Lost is that while it’s possible she’s lying and did cheat on Jin, it’s also very possible that the island has decided that they should have a baby. If it can make Locke walk, it can make Jin fertile."
- "I don't and won't believe the baby is the bald dude's. Could Sun survive a pregnancy after a plane crash?"
- "Hasn't it been about 55 or 60 days since they crashed? (e: YES, 58) If Sun had been planning on ditching Jin at the Sydney airport, completely possible it's Bald Dude's Baby. She coulda survived the crash pregnant, because in the news a few months back was a skydiver that crashed on her HEAD, broke ribs and learned she was pregnant..."
- "...although it was left way too ambiguous whether or not Sun was lying. Mouth says no but facial expressions say...maybe?"
- "I couldn't figure out why Sun was so reluctant towards the idea of having a baby, in general. I think there is a lot more to this story."
- "Clearly the father of Sun's baby is Alvar Hanso. Or even worse ... Donald Trump!"
- "If she was going to lie to him about the paternity, why tell him he was sterile? If she's lying, she might as well lie completely. There's no reason to tell him he's sterile unless she wants to tell him the whole truth."
- "Put me in the camp of believing it's Baldy's baby. I think Sun was on the verge of telling Jin "the whole truth" and then realized she does love the guy, he loves her, and they're stuck on this island for maybe forever. Why take the advice of a hypocritical asshat like Jack when everyone can be happy with a lie? Could an embryo survive the crash? How did any of them survive?"
- "If Sun was just now feeling lightheaded and nauseous, she was only a few days pregnant. No way would those symptoms suddenly appear after 60ish days. I don't believe she would have cheated either. She was completely focused on escaping and besides, wouldn't she have been terrified what Jin or her father would do to a lover? No, they were just friends. She told Jin the "whole truth" because she nearly lost him once before because of a secret. She layed everything out on the table. No more secrets, no more guilt."
- "I don't think Sun's lying. When Jack was checking out the test result and said she was indeed pregnant, she said it was impossible. As in, it's impossible because Jin is sterile."
- "Someone may have already said this, but Sun probably looked guilty at the end because she never told Jin she was planning on leaving him, not because she had an affair. Her lies have been more ommissions of information, rather than misinformation. If she said she has never slept with anyone else I believe her."


FOR MY NERDY PEEPS

This group of postings, representing what can only be described as an utter outcry on the boards about the grammatical mistake in the Korean subtitles, sums up WHY I love reading the boards. Before you tell me that closed-captioning always has mistakes (which it does), remember that this was NOT closed-captioning, but rather the subtitles on the show itself.

If you could care less about this (though there ARE some hilarious posts below), skip to the next section.

If you do care, my nerdy brethren, know that you are in good company:

- "The subtitles said "You're husband" instead of "Your husband" during the conversation twixt Sun and the doctor."
- "The sloppy captioning of when they were speaking Korean is bugging the shit out of me ("you're husband"?). GAH."
- "Are you f-ing kidding me? "You're husband." That is disgraceful."
- "I must give props to other grammar nerds on this talkback that spotted the HORRENDOUS your-you're error. Shameful for a show that is one of its network's tentpegs."
- "I think they're (or is it "their"? or "there"?) messing with our heads again... ; )(Sorry to be so picky about the grammar thing... I'm still reeling from the subtitle mistake...)"
- "Do they not have proofreaders in their budget??"
- "Also, as a professional copyeditor, I seethed at that typo in the subtitles. They had better correct that for the DVD!!!"
- "The "you're husband" was bugging the crap out of me too. Try harder, Closed Captioning Monkeys."
- "HOLY HELL Damon/J.J. - fire the subtitlers immediately. Kwan? You're father? Horrifying. HORRIFYING."
- "So much going on and everyone's worried about the captioning? It's a good thing y'all aren't watching "24", where the Prez declared "Marshall Law" last week."
- "Is it possible the you're/your captioning problem was done just to upset the anal retentive people on this board?"
- "If so, that's a terrible thing for the people who do the captions (whoever they may be) to do. The last thing the English language needs is a super-popular television show that many high-schoolers watch to be perpetuating such breaches of basic grammar. "
- "I don't even watch Lost, but I am a writer by trade and therefore a huge grammar dork. When the "you're husband" came on, my fiance called me in from the other room to see it. It bothered me so much that I went to ABC.com this morning and sent them an email complaint. I have enough to do editing people's terrible grammar without help from Lost. My email said: Dear ABC: I was horrified to see "You're husband. . . he works for your father" in the show's captioning (not closed captioning) of last night's episode. As one of the biggest shows on TV, Lost should be able to prevent such blatant errors from making it on air. The show has a massive audience, and kids (as well as many adults) have enough problems with proper English without seeing errors like that reinforced. ABC should issue a statement acknowledging and correcting the error. Thank you. I encourage fellow grammar geeks to do the same! http://abc.go.com/site/contactus.html"

HENRY GALE, YOU ARE ONE SCARY MOFO

As I mentioned above, while I liked this episode (I would've liked ANYTHING they aired that was new because it hadn't been on in so long)... I definitely thought it was kind of blah... that is, until the utterly bone-chilling speech by Mr. Gale at the end. I was literally squirming in my seat.

The "is he or isn't he an Other?" debate was the biggest issue on the boards, so I've pasted in many comments on the topic below. One thing that bothered me, however, was that a few episodes ago Henry made a POINT of mentioning how thin the walls/doors were... so much so that he actually shouted out to Jack and Locke at one point because he was following their conversation. However, in the two episodes since, characters on the outside of the cell have not been able to hear what's going on inside. Some chalk this up to Henry's Otherness and the fact that he must have superhuman hearing just like Ethan had superhuman strength. I'm not sure yet...

My take on Henry overall is that I think they're now making it TOO OBVIOUS for him to actually end up being an Other. I don't think he crashed on the island after going on a balloon trip with his wife, either, though. All I know for sure is that he gives me nightmares.

One small thing he said, however, that made me pause and reconsider his Otherness was: "Of course, if I was one of them -- these people that you seem to think are your enemies -- what would I do?" The whole "that you SEEM to think are your enemies" part was suspect to me because The Others also tend to act like they are really the good guys doing everyone a favor by "letting" them live on the island. It just was an odd thing to say if he knew nothing of The Others other than what he had learned while being held captive.
- "Henry Gale reminds me, eerily, of Kevin Spacey's character in Seven - very disturbing, evil, sadistic... and genius. A scary combination."
- "Total shout out to us for asking why people weren't more curious about things!"
- "Holy....is the prisoner an Other or a bad seed or...I don't know what to think."
- "The actor playing Henry really nailed that final speech, although, at this point, it's hard to see how anyone would doubt he's an Other."
- "If Damon Lindelof and J.J. Abrams had any sense in their brain, they would add Henry Gale to the main cast. I never thought a man who seemed so insignificant could be such a scheming catalyst. He is EXCELLENT, and he has made this episode for me."
- "I find it mind numbingly bizarre that NO one calls him on his obvious mind games. They just all sit around looking constipated whenever he says his little spiels. Well, except for Sayid. He just beat the daylights out of him."
- "That last scene. Was. Brilliant. So smart to keep the camera on Henry and not cut away to the three (trapped?) searchers. Keeping it in our imagination made it so much creepier."
- "I still don't see what finding the balloon would really prove. For all we know, Henry Gale and the other Others simply killed the real ballooners and now he's conveniently trying to pass himself off as his own victim." (e: AGREED!!!!)
- "I felt that Henry's conversation with Jack about the difference between a prophet and a martyr was significant. One definition for prophet is an effective spokesman or leader for a cause, doctrine or group. A definition for martyr is a person who voluntarily suffers death as the penalty of witnessing to and refusing to denounce a religion. A hint about why he is there perhaps. Of course Jack didn't bite, saying they both end up dead. However, he did let Henry out for breakfast after that conversation."



OTHER RANDOM POSTS


- "And what were Sayid and Charlie building?"
- "Sayid and Charlie could sure use someone keen in construction, but unfortunately Michael has gone batshit. Are they maybe building a church? Raft 2.0? A Starbucks? Could be anything."
- "Michael Who?"
- "A building with a "Widmore Construction" sign showed up in "Fire + Water". Unfortunately, I haven't been able to track down that one legible screenshot that was floating around a few weeks ago. (e: Widmore was the maker of the pregnancy test Sun took as well)
- "Lots of seemingly obvious shout-outs in this ep: "People don't like me.""
- "I want to bitch-slap the writers for the needless Hurley candy-bar scene. He has the potential to be a REALLY fascinating character on this show (remember folks, he's both rich and "crazy"), but instead they're pulling this stereotypical food-hoarding comic-relief fat-dude bullshit. STOP IT. Give us some really good Hurley material (remember him outing Ethan with his census?), or else send him where Boone and Shannon went." (e: I'm pretty sure we will get better Hurley material soon, fear not)
- "Loved Jin listening to Sawyer and Bernard talk in Korean. Just cracked me up for some reason."
- "Jin hears Sawyer and Bernard talking backwards, so what would Jin hear if he had a vision of Walt?"
- "Oh, and just as everyone predicted, absolutely no mention of ANYTHING that happened last episode."
- "If I were Jack or Locke, I'd be digging into the bottom of that Dharma Cereal Box to find the secret Lost Decoder Ring."
- "Perfect... Dharma-Os, each little piece in the shape of an octagon with a little hole in the center. Maybe it comes with snake, shark, and swan-shaped marshmallows?"
- "Any name suggestions for the Kwon baby? I'm going to go with Moonshine. It'd fit with the celestial nature of Sun's name and the Jin/gin homonym that brings alcohol to mind."




BEST LINES OF THE EPISODE

[Sawyer is reading "Are you there God? It's me, Margaret."]
Sun: How's your book?
Sawyer: ...Not nearly enough sex.


ANA: So let me get this straight -- you and your wife travel around the world and crash here in a smiley-face balloon? Then she dies. You get captured by a French chick who brings you here, and then they lock you up.
GALE: It sounds kind of silly when you say it like that.


SAYID [pointing]: That cliff there appears to be this [showing the spot on the map].
ANA: Score one for Henry.
SAYID: Pointing out a geographical touchstone does not mean he's leading us to a balloon.
ANA: Maybe not, but at least we're on the right island.
[Sayid walks off.]
CHARLIE: Humor's not his strong suit. [Ana doesn't respond] And I'm saying this to you.
[They continue walking. Charlie looks around and sees Ana staring at him.]
CHARLIE: You looking at my bum?



SAWYER [entering]: Yo, Daddy-o.
JIN: Sawyer.
SAWYER: Way to go, Papa-san. You didn't waste much time. I'd give you a cigar, Bernie, but I'm fresh out.



[after creepy, threatening tirade]
Henry: You guys got any milk?



UPCOMING EPISODES

OK my friends... I have what should be the Lost episode calendar for the rest of the season... but of course I'm sure things could possibly change. Really, though, there's not much wiggle room in the schedule anymore and most sources say this is final. Here's what it currently looks like... we have 3 weeks of new episodes in a row:

03/29/06 - 'Lockdown' - My man gets caught within the blast doors?!?!?! Looks like this will be a great one. Per the preview: "5 events will happen..." My prediction: the boarders will be fighting over exactly WHAT the 5 Events were...

04/05/06 - 'Dave'

04/12/06 - 'S.O.S.'

A short break... then the drive to the finale:

05/03/06 - 'Two for the Road'

05/10/06 - Untitled... ep 21

5/17/06 - Untitled... ep 22

And then...


MARK YOUR CALENDARS! THE FINALE DATE HAS BEEN ANNOUNCED

Thanks to my brother for the heads up - it will be two hours on May 24th - the finale will be episodes 23 and 24.


REALLY SHORT VERSION OF THE 'MEMORY IMPLANT' THEORY

Since I don't have a lot of time this week... just know that there is what I consider to be a HIGHLY plausible theory floating around lately about the possibility that all of the flashbacks are fake - as in, they are "memories" implanted in the minds of the Lostaways by whatever sinister force is controlling the island. The proponents of this theory claim that this would explain why characters are showing up in each others' flashbacks, as well. Further, they state that there wasn't even a plane crash - which would explain why no one was really too hurt. That's where I think it begins to fall apart... remember that dude who got chopped up by the propeller? Tell this theory to him!!!! So in short, while I think the memories possibly could be implanted, I don't think the crash was staged.



BEFORE THEY WERE LOST

Thanks to MD as well as an anonymous Comment poster for this site that shows pre-Lost video clips of Sawyer (my favorite - I REMEMBER that horrible commercial), Kate and Sayid.

Before There Were Lost

And at a separate site, here is pre-Lost Hurley (along with Pedro from Napoleon Dynamite - SWEET!)

Before Hurley was Lost, Dude.


Enjoy this week's episode, it should be a doozy.
- e


*To post comments, click on the Comments link below. You don't have to have a username or log in or anything. I post comments after I review them, typically each night.*